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Cynisca
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 605
Location: Living in Yorkshire UK - ê tan ê epi tas
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 Posted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 9:18 pm Post subject: |
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| apelles wrote: | There isn,t the faintest hope of the church agreeing to D.N.A.testing because there,s too much to lose if it does turn out the be Alexander.Andrew Chugg,however,makes out a very good case in his letter to the Vatican.I had a quiet word with "St. Mark "when I visited the tomb last year,just in case it was actually Alexander.  |
I can't see that they will lose if it turns out to be Alexander....they will simply gain a different sort of pilgrim to the shrine....or do they think that Alexander does not appeal to Christians because he was not one himself ..... 
If it does turn out to be St Mark, well they have the confirmation they need and we know we have to go and look elsewhere for our Alex...
This reeks of the old 'reliquary' containing the hair of St Bridget or the mummified finger of St Paul......which were obtained from a more recent corpse...but kept the church coffers full!
I hope 'St Marcus' Alexandros' heard you.....could you actually see anything or do they still have him in down in that damp cellar....rotting  !
regards
Cynisca |
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apelles
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 1152
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| Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="Cynisca" | Quote: | | I can't see that they will lose if it turns out to be Alexander....they will simply gain a different sort of pilgrim to the shrine....or do they think that Alexander does not appeal to Christians because he was not one himself ..... |
I think the Church would be horrified to find out that a pagan had been deified and laid to rest in one of the greatest Christian basilicas in the world.Egg on face time?
| Quote: | | This reeks of the old 'reliquary' containing the hair of St Bridget or the mummified finger of St Paul......which were obtained from a more recent corpse...but kept the church coffers full! |
I think you hit the nail on the head there!
| Quote: | | I hope 'St Marcus' Alexandros' heard you.....could you actually see anything or do they still have him in down in that damp cellar....rotting ! |
Couldn,t actually see much at all but maybe he heard anyway.Hope so. |
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joanna
Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1270
Location: Greece/USA/Italy/UK/
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| Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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I believe the church has no right to refuse a DNA test. There are people out there who want to learn the truth. By refusing the test doesn't make them seem reliable and trustworthy. If they are sure that S. Mark is there , then why they refuse? I can't see the point. Or ....they are not sure at all; but they ( I repeat) have no right to refuse the DNA test.
If it's proved they're Alexander's remains I think ( like Cynisca said) they won't lose anything. It's going to be one of the greatest historical discoveries and not lose but they will gain a lot. After all if they have Alexander there instead of the Saint it is not their fault. It was somebody else's fault long time ago. Why are they afraid, then?
We should do something about it. I have to think.... |
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apelles
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 1152
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| Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:05 pm Post subject: |
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| joanna wrote: | I believe the church has no right to refuse a DNA test. There are people out there who want to learn the truth. By refusing the test doesn't make them seem reliable and trustworthy. If they are sure that S. Mark is there , then why they refuse? I can't see the point. Or ....they are not sure at all; but they ( I repeat) have no right to refuse the DNA test.
If it's proved they're Alexander's remains I think ( like Cynisca said) they won't lose anything. It's going to be one of the greatest historical discoveries and not lose but they will gain a lot. After all if they have Alexander there instead of the Saint it is not their fault. It was somebody else's fault long time ago. Why are they afraid, then?
We should do something about it. I have to think.... |
Agreed Joanna,it doesn,t show the Church in a good light if they refuse the test,but you know how conservative they can be.I,d much rather it was Alexander than St.Mark.I,d be incredibly excited,wouldn,t you? |
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Adriv
Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 1144
Location: Maryland, USA
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| Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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Even if this is true. Why there?  don't you think it's weird?  |
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joanna
Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1270
Location: Greece/USA/Italy/UK/
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| Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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For Adriv:
Why there? You mean why in Venice?
For Apelles:
Excited? I would be thrilled to pieces  I would be....I don't know how to say it. Words fail me.
I wish it could be true. Alexander found, at last!!! What an excitment  |
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Adriv
Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 1144
Location: Maryland, USA
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| Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 9:04 pm Post subject: |
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| joanna wrote: | For Adriv:
Why there? You mean why in Venice? |
Yes, why in Venice, Italy? |
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joanna
Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1270
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Cynisca
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 605
Location: Living in Yorkshire UK - ê tan ê epi tas
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| Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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Hi,
I nearly put in my post that us Alexandrians should create some sort of fuss at St Marks, but it could put us in a bad light..which we don't really want, especially if after all it turned out to not be Alex....
Has Andrew asked people to sign a petition to ask for this testing to be done?
The fact that the church is hesitating means that they probably do have doubts and are scared of the truth, but whichever truth it turns out to be, I am sure will increase pilgrimages/tourism and revenue..... 
After all, Alexander was said to have paved the way for a different form of worship and was not Helios also originally used to portray Jesus...? There is a chariot with four horses in St Marks square.....the chariot of Helios had four horses too...add that to the winged lion....very Pagan symbolism...! (Of course much christian symbolism was adopted from the older faiths)
regards
Cynisca |
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Adriv
Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 1144
Location: Maryland, USA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 2:45 pm Post subject: |
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Gosh, I love that site! Good one Joanna  |
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joanna
Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1270
Location: Greece/USA/Italy/UK/
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| Posted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks Adriv.
Cynisca, I believe we should do something. Let's think about that. I'll ask Andrew Chugg if there is a petition and if there is I'm going to sign it. If not we can make one. If the church continues rejecting the test it means, as you said, they have doubts. So they are on the weak side. They are not as strong and confident as they want to appear. On the other hand we are ordinary people but we have the right to know the truth. If it's proved we are wrong, we'll accept it. We are not the mighty(?) church. |
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apelles
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 1152
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| Posted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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| joanna wrote: | Thanks Adriv.
Cynisca, I believe we should do something. Let's think about that. I'll ask Andrew Chugg if there is a petition and if there is I'm going to sign it. If not we can make one. If the church continues rejecting the test it means, as you said, they have doubts. So they are on the weak side. They are not as strong and confident as they want to appear. On the other hand we are ordinary people but we have the right to know the truth. If it's proved we are wrong, we'll accept it. We are not the mighty(?) church. |
There,s no reason why we can,t say what we think,in a civilized and non-confrontational way.After all if you can,t stand it,you gotta fix it. |
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cindoo15
Joined: 29 Nov 2004
Posts: 1282
Location: Dallas TX
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 6:26 am Post subject: |
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Yet another book to add to our list! |
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cindoo15
Joined: 29 Nov 2004
Posts: 1282
Location: Dallas TX
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 6:31 am Post subject: |
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| Cynisca wrote: | | apelles wrote: | | There isn,t the faintest hope of the church agreeing to D.N.A.testing because there,s too much to lose if it does turn out the be Alexander.Andrew Chugg,however,makes out a very good case in his letter to the Vatican.I had a quiet word with "St. Mark "when I visited the tomb last year,just in case it was actually Alexander. |
I can't see that they will lose if it turns out to be Alexander....they will simply gain a different sort of pilgrim to the shrine....or do they think that Alexander does not appeal to Christians because he was not one himself ..... |
Bingo! How frieghtening - a pagan in a major Christian shrine? I could never believe such a thing could happen!! Do yall know how cynical I can be? If not, well this was a good example. |
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cindoo15
Joined: 29 Nov 2004
Posts: 1282
Location: Dallas TX
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 6:32 am Post subject: |
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| apelles wrote: | [quote="Cynisca" | Quote: | | I can't see that they will lose if it turns out to be Alexander....they will simply gain a different sort of pilgrim to the shrine....or do they think that Alexander does not appeal to Christians because he was not one himself ..... |
I think the Church would be horrified to find out that a pagan had been deified and laid to rest in one of the greatest Christian basilicas in the world.Egg on face time? |
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