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MACEDONIAN ETYMOLOGY OF FILM CHARACTERS
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ChristianMacedon



Joined: 08 Apr 2004
Posts: 211
Location: Portsmouth, United Kingdom

PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2004 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My point is you give a greek meaning to the greek words,get it?

ie.Alexander,Philip,Macedon,Buchefal etc. are not greek, Alexandros,Philipos,Buchefalos etc. are the greek words for the ones mentioned earlier,so you give a meaning behind it from a greek porspective.

now i hope it is more clear.
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MACEDONIC



Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 77
Location: GREECE

PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2004 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boy, we seem to have a communication problem here.Let me put it this way.
Alexander is not a Greek word as u very well said.It is English.Nevertheless its root is the Greek word Alexandros which means....bla bla bla...
Philip is not a Greek word as u very well said.It is English.Nevertheless its root is the Greek word Phillipos which means.....bla bla bla.....

I hope my Christian brother this makes it easier for u
(BTW "Christian" comes from Greek too...)

Greg....
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ChristianMacedon



Joined: 08 Apr 2004
Posts: 211
Location: Portsmouth, United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

there is no communication problem, we are just stating our opinions. and from your last post i can see that we are clear about what i wanted to say.
Laughing Laughing Very Happy
Quote:
BTW "Christian" comes from Greek too.

i'd like to know more please Very Happy
thanks in advance.
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Ptolemy V



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 111

PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 5:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChristianMacedon wrote:
My point is you give a greek meaning to the greek words,get it?

ie.Alexander,Philip,Macedon,Buchefal etc. are not greek, Alexandros,Philipos,Buchefalos etc. are the greek words for the ones mentioned earlier,so you give a meaning behind it from a greek porspective.

now i hope it is more clear.


Someone has got their "timeline" out of synch - what comes first is very easy indeed:

In the original Greek sources the names are written in Greek. In the Latin sources they are "Latinized" - so Alexandros becomes Alexander, etc.

The English variants of the names are based on the Latinized variants. It is these Anglicised variants that are in the English texts we read today.

There is no need for theorising about the original names - the texts of the ancient authors and inscriptions found at the archealogical sites of Macedonia make it clear - Philippos, Lysimachos, Ptolemeos etc are the names of these people.

One final thing - the Latinized and Anglicised versions of the names mean nothing - only in the original Greek is the meaning and root of the names clear.
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ChristianMacedon



Joined: 08 Apr 2004
Posts: 211
Location: Portsmouth, United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
ne final thing - the Latinized and Anglicised versions of the names mean nothing

you never know, maybe they got a meaning as well.
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dynamo



Joined: 15 Mar 2004
Posts: 289
Location: GB

PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
One final thing - the Latinized and Anglicised versions of the names mean nothing


I'm insulted. The names may just be names and have no direct link to the persons personality but they still mean something.

My name means "Peaceful-ruler" (from the German "rid" and "ric" I think) and I may not be a peaceful ruler. Or a ruler at all etc etc but my name still means something even if it is Anglicanised and Latinised from the original Scandinavian or Slavic origins.

All names mean something. Even those of Greece, Macedon, Athens, Sparta, London, England, Babylon, and Mesopotamia.

Even if the roots of the names are lost in time they still mean something. Even if the name is changed into a differnt language it still means something even if it is just a watch-word for someone being a twisted son of a b*tch or whatever (that last comment is a genralisation and not aimed at any name I can think of).

ALexander, Alexandre or Alexandros, or however it is spelt still means "defending men" at it's root. That cannot be changed in exactly the same way as England's etymology cannot be changed from "Angleland" the land of the Angles.

Etymologies may be slightly different in different places but generaly they are set in stone.
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dynamo



Joined: 15 Mar 2004
Posts: 289
Location: GB

PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know.
Also:
Mesopotamia= Land between two rivers

London= from the latin name for the city Londinium which has something to do with the Latin name for the Thames.

Babylon= a city devoted to materialism and sensual pleasure

ALEKSANDAR- Balkland's form of ALexander

Not sure about the others: Anyone any Idea?
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Ptolemy V



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 111

PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2004 6:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Macedon - the name is derived from the tribe of the "Makednoi" ("ma(e)kos" = length).

It has the same root, which means 'long', 'high' or 'tall' as in the Greek adjective 'makednos' or the noun 'mekos.'

The name Macedon therefore derives from 'Makedones' which means "tall people" or "highlanders".

The Greek word 'makednos' is first mentioned in Homer's Odyssey (Od. H106), and later by Herodotus, who called 'Makednon eunos' the various Doric tribes among which he included the Macedonians (Her. I.56, VIII.43):

"...during the reign of Deucalion, Phthiotis was the country in which the Hellenes dwelt, but under Dorus, the son of Hellen, they moved to the tract at the base of Ossa and Olympus, which is called Histiaeotis; forced to retire from that region by the Cadmeians, they settled, under the name of Macedni, in the chain of Pindus."
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Ptolemy V



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 111

PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2004 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From www.etymonline.com:

Macedonia - from L. Macedonius "Macedonian," from Gk. Makedones, lit. "highlanders" or "the tall ones," related to makednos "long, tall," makros "long, large."

http://www.etymonline.com/m1etym.htm
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dynamo



Joined: 15 Mar 2004
Posts: 289
Location: GB

PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2004 7:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've heard Lerin's etymology before but not Ptomely's.

And surely a country calls itself by it's own name in the native tounge and it may just be that the people of the surrounding area (i.e Hellenic peoples) would have come up with a different etymology for the same name in their own tongue.
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Macedonian lion



Joined: 28 Nov 2003
Posts: 102

PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2004 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I've heard Lerin's etymology before but not Ptomely's.


To be honest i havent heard about Lerins before, but Ptolemys. And i also thought that on west is the only accepted Ptolemys one. I never thought they accept any others. So i must say i was more than pleasently surprised when i read you havent heard about Ptolemys etimology. Dynamo would you please tell me where have you heard about Lerins etymology.

Quote:
And surely a country calls itself by it's own name in the native tounge and it may just be that the people of the surrounding area (i.e Hellenic peoples) would have come up with a different etymology for the same name in their own tongue.


I AGREE Very Happy !!! But sometimes the name that is given from foreigners prevailes. If they are military or culturaly stronger.
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dynamo



Joined: 15 Mar 2004
Posts: 289
Location: GB

PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2004 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i can't actualy remember. It was on some online encyclopedia when I was looking for some other stuff and I found it.

Quote:
But sometimes the name that is given from foreigners prevailes. If they are military or culturaly stronger.


I know. The only trouble is though is that generaly the country calls itself by one name (generaly the native name) and the foriegners by another and only if the country is completely colonised and amalgamated into the stronger country then do they accept the other name.

Lets just say that there are deffinately different etymologies for the same words in different tounges. If those etymologies mean almost the same thing (Highlanders generaly come from mountainous countries) then it could be said that there is not a lot of point arguing over which one is better, worse, right, wrong or who came up with which one first (it all makes sense to me Exclamation).
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Macedonian lion



Joined: 28 Nov 2003
Posts: 102

PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2004 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, but must still observe the original etymologies. Mako- mountains OR long, Don- country OR people.

There are aswel some others, for example Make as Mother and Don as Country or God,Goddes. Not that weird, because we know that the great mother goddes was worshiped in prehistoric times. So we come to conlcusion Mother Goddes or Mother Country.

There are even some etymologies that come from Hindy religion, and even this are not the only i guess. So i more than agree with you when you said that from ONE word in many other languages can come many etymologies. But i am still surprised, how could exactly from this word Makedon came so many etymologies.
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Macedonian lion



Joined: 28 Nov 2003
Posts: 102

PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2004 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
those etymologies mean almost the same thing (Highlanders generaly come from mountainous countries) then it could be said that there is not a lot of point arguing over which one is better, worse, right, wrong or who came up with which one first (it all makes sense to me ).

Quote:
Macedonia - from L. Macedonius "Macedonian," from Gk. Makedones, lit. "highlanders" or "the tall ones," related to makednos "long, tall," makros "long, large."


Uh, i just realized, what you two meant. I wouldnt call high people highlanders, highlanders means people that live in high places, mountains, hills, barbaric people. But high people means people that are tall, and this has nothing to do with highlanders. Tall people means people that are racial different, highlanders means linguistical and cultural different people.

Quote:
if the country is completely colonised and amalgamated into the stronger country then do they accept the other name.


Not just that, sometimes it is "enough" that one nation has written language and other not, and so others know this country by name that is used from other country in written sources.
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Ptolemy V



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 111

PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2004 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Macedonian lion wrote:

Uh, i just realized, what you two meant. I wouldnt call high people highlanders, highlanders means people that live in high places, mountains, hills, barbaric people. But high people means people that are tall, and this has nothing to do with highlanders. Tall people means people that are racial different, highlanders means linguistical and cultural different people.


Hmmm, I don't think a "tall person" means prima facie "racial" difference. Neither does "highlander" of itself imply "linguistic" or "cultural" difference. That is your simply your interpretation and spin on the etymology (because you are looking for it to mean something different).

The word Makedones means "long, tall, high" people and thus can can apply to a person as either a "tall" person or a "highlander".

See www.etymonline.com - its on their site as such.

Its also included as the meaning in a number of books on the ancient Macedonians, including works by scholars Ian Worthington, Robin Lane Fox and Nicholas Hammond.

You yourself say this is the meaning that is accepted in the "West":
Macedonian lion wrote:
And i also thought that on west is the only accepted Ptolemys one.
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