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Brokeback Mountain
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cindoo15



Joined: 29 Nov 2004
Posts: 1282
Location: Dallas TX

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 5:23 am    Post subject: Re: Brokeass MT Reply with quote

LEONIDAS wrote:
Leonidas here with his once in while posts that I write. But I had to say something about the recent all american gay cowboy movie that everyone here in the good old right wing United States is raving about. One thing I wouldnt take my dog to this picture!!! All this is Hollywood hype and Iknow becasue I live less than two hours from hollywood I am so sick of hearing about this movie!!!! Whats the difference alexander dealt with gay issues and I would hardly say that american cowboys are heroic not compared to alexander no way jose!!! America cannot not relate to alexander like it does in Europe thats why the movie flopped over here americans dont care about ancient history just their own from 1776 and onward !!! It s a fact yes there are a few of us in here adriv and cindoo who are only a few who still love this movie from america but most of you are from europe and this is part of your history most of all . But for me it will always be part of me Either it be Greek or Roman history I am with it until the end!!!!thank you!!


Isn't that odd? I'm saying that what you mean by Americans only being interested in their own history - how bizarre. To me, European history is my history because I am of European heritage - and that would be true for most of Americans as well.
Just think about how much of the US was set up based on ancient democracy and then, of coarse, there's the architecture - anybody taken a look around Washington DC? Hello!!!!! Oh, and yes, there is that LATIN on the money. Hmm, how can anybody doubt that if not for the ancient Greeks and Romans - this would not be the same place it is today.

On another note - I also wondered how Brokeback Mountain got such great reviews (I haven't seen it so I don't know anything yet - aside from the obvious) from critics that panned Alexander so. I guess it wasn't the American homophobia afterall.
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LEONIDAS



Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 201
Location: southern califorina

PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hey pam maybe back then but nowdays americans dont care anything about ancient history!!! truth hurts doesnt it!!!!
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cindoo15



Joined: 29 Nov 2004
Posts: 1282
Location: Dallas TX

PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It sure does.
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apelles



Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 1152

PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

joanna wrote:
I came back home an hour ago. It's around 3.00. Yes, I know it's late but I wanted to tell you that I was at the cinema. I saw 'Brokeback Mountain'....twice! That's why I returned home so late.
What I think about it, I'll tell you tomorrow........

Joanna,I can,t wait ANOTHER MINUTE to read what you thought of it!Please put me out of my misery!
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joanna



Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1270
Location: Greece/USA/Italy/UK/

PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, Ok, here I am.

Pipsqueak wrote :

Quote:
Is it just me or did it seem to be lacking all the passion America has said it has ?


And how about the passion in 'Alexander' then ? nothing ? niente ? tipota ? nada ?

Quote:
There was more passion and longing portrayed between Colin and Jared atop the balcony in Alexander than there was in the whole of this film.


I......agree.

Quote:
It seems the only way Hollywood believes two men to kiss is by looking as if there trying to head-butt one another-


Smile That's why they were meeting twice a year. They needed this time between the kisses so they could be all right again.
What kisses ! Then " Stay with me tonight " was a shock Question Are they kidding us or what ?


During the second viewing I paid more attention on the actors' facial expressions and the eyes as they show feelings. I have the feeling that on some scenes there should be more passion and on others less ! Is that only my impression ? Of course Heath's performance is not bad at all ! Gyllenhaal is just ok. And Rodrigo Prieto's job is superb, as usual. Yes, I understand the scenery, the country, the mountains, the sheep ( aren't they cute ? ) is a positive thing in the movie. But to see the mount is not that important. The main theme here is the relationship between these two men. I believe this movie could be a very good theatrical play. The mountains could be a scenery at the back of the stage. The audience could concentrate on these two men's 'problem'. They fall in love with each other desperately. But they can't even pronounce the word "love". On the other hand they manage to say : " I ain't queer ", " Me, neither "
They don't want to admit it. They don't want to believe it. But they know they are 'different'.



Adriv wrote :



Quote:
4 Golden Globes ! Wow!
Now more than ever I want to see the movie


I went to see the movie not for the 4 G.G. I don't believe in them. I dont' believe in Oscars, either. After what happened to 'Alexander' I trust only my opinion. (anyway I have always trusted my opinion )
Critics put 'Alexander' among the worst movies of the year. Do we have to believe them ? NO! They shouldn't be trusted.
They put ' Brokeback Mountain' among the best movies of the year. Do we have to believe them ? NO! They can't be trusted, you remember ?



Leonidas wrote :

Quote:
What's the difference Alexander dealt with gay issues and I would hardly say that American cowboys are heroic not compared to Alexander no way


There is a big difference. In 'Alexander' the gay issue ( which was not an issue back then Exclamation )was performed in a better way. The deep relationship and caring between Alexander and Hephaestion was shown in their eyes. We see not a single kiss between them but their passion was ..there ! The time that they are on the balcony and Alexander tells Heph : " You are the one I love, Hephaestion. Nobody else! "
Have you noticed Alexander's eyes ? Of course, you have . Weren't they burning with passion ? That's enough...
Difference between the two movies ? Oh, yes, big difference, indeed !


apelles wrote :

Quote:
Ennis was just too taciturn to openly show the depth of his love and also too terrified of society,s violent reaction, whereas Alexander and Hephaistion,s relationship was within the conventions of ther culture and therefore could be expressed without restrictions


Yes, and then we have the American critics ( who have always right, according to fools around the world ) who praise " Brokeback Mountain" exactly for THIS ! The homosexuality. Two gay men, poor men, they can't show their love because their society doesn't accept it. Oh, somebody help them. Poor creatures.
And on the other hand : " Alexander the Gay ", ha, ha, ha ; it's so funny !

Now with that " too much" praise for "Brok-Mount" i feel more for 'Alexander'. As I have already told you, Janie, Alexander's unjust treatment still hurts. And now with this 'poor gay men, who hide their secret at the mountain' movie it hurts even more!

Viva, Hollywood hypocrisy ! You're so strong. I bow to you !
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joanna



Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1270
Location: Greece/USA/Italy/UK/

PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, I admit that I got carried away before. After all it's not right. I can't say my opinion for a film comparing it to another. They are two different movies.

So, if I didn't make myself understood , let me tell you that I liked "Brokeback Mountain". Because as an open-minded person I understand and really feel for these two guys. After all 'LOVE' is what matters. Why should I laugh at them ?
Yes, I liked it.

Alma, Ennis' wife gives such a good performance.

Two scenes are my favourite ones.

First when Ennis and Jack reunite after 4 years ( why it took them so much ? ). We can see Ennis waiting by the window for his friend to come like a schoolgirl ( in this case Confused sorry ) waiting anxiously for her boyfriend. And when Jack showns up Ennis' face, his whole face smiles. I think it is the only time we see him smile in the movie. I mean a true smile.
The other scene is when Ennis visits Jack's parents. The mother plays good. What I like there is not what is said but what is not said !



Did I mention 'Alexander' this time ? Bravo ! I managed not to Smile


Before I finish I have something else to say.
I have read a couple of books and I can proudly say I know the American History. A couple of books is enough to learn the basic things about a nation's history.

Keep it in mind....Americans Exclamation

( not you Pam, Adriv, Leonidas and all the Americans here in the forum. I mean the other ones.....)
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cindoo15



Joined: 29 Nov 2004
Posts: 1282
Location: Dallas TX

PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

joanna wrote:

Before I finish I have something else to say.
I have read a couple of books and I can proudly say I know the American History. A couple of books is enough to learn the basic things about a nation's history.

Keep it in mind....Americans Exclamation

( not you Pam, Adriv, Leonidas and all the Americans here in the forum. I mean the other ones.....)


Hmm, I really have no idea at all what you're talking about. Keep what in mind?????
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joanna



Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1270
Location: Greece/USA/Italy/UK/

PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cindoo15 wrote:
joanna wrote:

Before I finish I have something else to say.
I have read a couple of books and I can proudly say I know the American History. A couple of books is enough to learn the basic things about a nation's history.

Keep it in mind....Americans Exclamation

( not you Pam, Adriv, Leonidas and all the Americans here in the forum. I mean the other ones.....)


Hmm, I really have no idea at all what you're talking about. Keep what in mind?????



Before going to see a historical film they'd better know something about that nation's history. Because,
-first, they can enjoy it better
- second, that would prevent them from talking nonsense

Alexander lived in a period that 'gay' word didn't exist and homosexuality or bisexuality was normal.
Soooooo, by saying 'Alexander the Gay', they seemed to be so ignorant Confused . They behaved so foolishly BUT the consequences were disastrous for the movie. They disappointed a lot of people who had worked very hard to make it.


Reading some historical books before going to see such a kind of film, helps. Believe me, Americans, so keep it in mind !!!!!
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apelles



Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 1152

PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My favourite scene is a very short flashback which comes during their final meeting when they part in anger Jack remembers an incident in the Brokeback summer when he was asleep on his feet and Ennis had come up behind him and put his arms round him.They just stand quietly until Jack,s head falls sideways into the crook of Ennis, arm.It,s just visually and emotionally stunning.Eventually Ennis lets him go and rides away and we return to the present as he watches Ennis drive off.It,s amazing how evocative a short,simple scene like this can be.
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Adriv



Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 1144
Location: Maryland, USA

PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

apelles wrote:
My favourite scene is a very short flashback which comes during their final meeting when they part in anger Jack remembers an incident in the Brokeback summer when he was asleep on his feet and Ennis had come up behind him and put his arms round him.They just stand quietly until Jack,s head falls sideways into the crook of Ennis, arm.It,s just visually and emotionally stunning.Eventually Ennis lets him go and rides away and we return to the present as he watches Ennis drive off.It,s amazing how evocative a short,simple scene like this can be.


*Sigh* yeah, that was so romantic Sad *sigh*
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joanna



Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1270
Location: Greece/USA/Italy/UK/

PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like that scene, too. Very romantic, indeed !
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Alexandros_19



Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 1230
Location: Argentina

PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

joanna wrote:
I came back home an hour ago. It's around 3.00. Yes, I know it's late but I wanted to tell you that I was at the cinema. I saw 'Brokeback Mountain'....twice! That's why I returned home so late.
What I think about it, I'll tell you tomorrow........


Joanna, is it a habit of yours to watch a movie more than once? Laughing Mine too, and I could list some movies that I've watched a thousand times (I know of one we've watched right about those many times). Smile
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Alexandros_19



Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 1230
Location: Argentina

PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I went to see Brokeback Mountain some days ago. A lot has been said about the movie, in this forum too. I read all of your comments and agree with many of them. I'll just say, to be brief, that I liked the movie, but I had higher expectations.
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Luna



Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 38

PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

O.k i know i am kind of late in asking this, but scince i have not seen the ending ( sad i know) could someone fill me in?
thanx
p.s. i still like alex the great better!
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apelles



Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 1152

PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Luna wrote:
O.k i know i am kind of late in asking this, but scince i have not seen the ending ( sad i know) could someone fill me in?
thanx
p.s. i still like alex the great better!

No problem.Well,I,m not sure how far you got in the story so I,ll start where Ennis gets a postcard from Jack to arrange their next trip and it,s marked" deceased"Absolutely devastated,he rings Jack,s wife,to find out what happened.It,s pretty clear that she either suspects or knows about Ennis but she explains that Jack was killed when a tyre he was changing blew up and he was hit by the rim.Ennis flashes to what he thinks happened,which is that Jack was killed by homophobes.We don,t know which is the truth.
After that Ennis finds out that part of Jack,s ashes were sent up to his parents in Lightning Flat and that Jack always wanted to be put onto Brokeback Mountain,so he goes up to the Twist ranch to see if he can carry out Jack,s last wishes.Did you get that far?
There,s a really heartbreaking scene with Jack,s parents.His mother obviously knows what Ennis meant to Jack and is sympathetic but his father is horrendous--domineering,small minded,stubborn and refuses to let the ashes go.Jack,s mother sends Ennis up to Jack,s old room.As he looks around,he finds,hidden away in an alcove two shirts from the last day on Brokeback,stained with blood.One shirt is carefully tucked inside the other.Ennis finally realises what he,s lost.He takes the shirts away with him,with Jack,s mother,s blessing and understanding.
The last scene shows Ennis alone in a dilapidated old trailer.Alma junior comes to tell him she,s getting married and to ask him to be there.He,s learned from his mistakes with Jack and agrees to be there for her.
The end shows him going to his closet and there,s an old postcard of Brokeback Mountain pinned up above the hanger with the two old shirts.Interestingly,the shirts are now reversed.When he found them,Jack,s was on the outside,protecting Ennis,but now Ennis,shirt is covering Jack,s.His last words are,"Jack,I swear........" Draw your own conclusions!

The end.Hope that helped you fill in a few gaps.
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